long ago ideas

“When we are tired, we are attacked by ideas we conquered long ago." - Friedrich Nietzsche. Long ago, Joseph Smith and Oliver Cowdery conquered false claims that the Book of Mormon was fiction or that it came through a stone in a hat. But these old claims have resurfaced in recent years. To conquer them again, we have to return to what Joseph and Oliver taught.

Wednesday, September 21, 2022

Moroni Day fundraiser by BMC

If you haven't heard, today (Sept 21, 2022) you can spend $250/plate to attend a fundraiser by Book of Mormon Central. 

$250/plate to add to the millions of dollars Book of Mormon Central is already spending to tell the world that Joseph Smith and Oliver Cowdery misled everyone about Cumorah and the translation of the Book of Mormon.

It's inexplicable why anyone would donate money to promote the private theories of a handful of scholars who repudiate the teachings of the prophets about Cumorah.

The ad for the fundraiser features the M2C logo* along with some historians who, as awesome as they are, will not tell the audience what Moroni first told Joseph Smith, even though we can all read what he said in the Joseph Smith Papers. These historians know these accounts perfectly well, but they refuse to share them, especially not to the donors who support Book of Mormon Central and its Mesoamerican/two-Cumorahs agenda.

(click to enlarge)

If Book of Mormon Central really wanted to be the central resource for information about the Book of Mormon, it would support and sustain the teachings of the prophets about Cumorah in New York instead of repudiating those teachings. 

At the very least, it would inform people about those teachings and the evidence that corroborates those teachings, instead of insisting that M2C is the only acceptable approach to understanding the Book of Mormon because Joseph and Oliver misled everyone.

Here are some of the things Moroni told Joseph Smith that the BMC audience will never learn about.

Moroni to Joseph Smith, 1823. "the record is on a side hill on the Hill of Cumorah 3 miles from this place remove the Grass and moss and you will find a large flat stone pry that up and you will find the record under it laying on 4 pillars of cement."


Moroni to Joseph Smith, 1823. He [Moroni] then proceeded and gave a general account of the promises made to the fathers, and also gave a history of the aborigenes of this country, and said they were literal descendants of Abraham. He represented them as once being an enlightned and intelligent people, possessing a correct knowledge of the gospel, and the plan of restoration and redemption. He said this history was written and deposited not far from that place, and that it was our brother’s privilege, if obedient to the commandments of the Lord, to obtain and translate the same by the means of the Urim and Thummim, which were deposited for that purpose with the record.


Joseph to his parents, 1827. said Joseph, “it was the angel of the Lord— as I passed by the hill of Cumorah, where the plates are, the angel of the Lord met me and said, that I had not been engaged enough in the work of the Lord; that the time had come for the record to <​be​> brought forth...


Oliver Cowdery, with the assistance of Joseph Smith. I must now give you some description of the place where, and the manner in which these records were deposited.

You are acquainted with the mail road from Palmyra, Wayne Co. to Canandaigua, Ontario Co. N.Y. and also, as you pass from the former to the latter place, before arriving at the little village of Manchester, say from three to four, or about four miles from Palmyra, you pass a large hill on the east side of the road. Why I say large, is because it is as large perhaps, as any in that country. To a person acquainted with this road, a description would be unnecessary, as it is the largest and rises the highest of any on that rout. The north end rises quite sudden until it assumes a level with the more southerly extremity, and I think I may say an elevation higher than at the south a short distance, say half or three fourths of a mile. As you pass toward canandaigua it lessens gradually until the surface assumes its common level, or is broken by other smaller hills or ridges, water courses and ravines. I think I am justified in saying that this is the highest hill for some distance round, and I am certain that its appearance, as it rises so suddenly from a plain on the north, must attract the notice of the traveller as he passes by.

At about one mile west rises another ridge of less height, running parallel with the former, leaving a beautiful vale between. The soil is of the first quality for the country, and under a state of cultivation, which gives a prospect at once imposing, when one reflects on the fact, that here, between these hills, the entire power and national strength of both the Jaredites and Nephites were destroyed.

By turning to the 529th and 530th pages of the book of Mormon120 you will read Mormon’s account of the last great struggle of his people, as they were encamped round this hill Cumorah. (it is printed Camorah, which is an error.) In this vally fell the remaining strength and pride of a once powerful people, the Nephites—once so highly favored of the Lord, but at that time in darkness, doomed to suffer extermination by the hand of their barbarous and uncivilized brethren. From the top of this hill, Mormon, with a few others, after the battle, gazed with horror upon the mangled remains of those who, the day before, were filled with anxiety, hope or doubt. A few had fled to the South, who were hunted down by the victorious party, and all who would not deny the Saviour and his religion, were put to death. Mormon himself, according to the record of his son Moroni, was also slain.

But a long time previous to this disaster it appears from his own account, he foresaw approaching destruction. In fact, if he perused the records of his fathers, which were in his possession, he could have learned that such would be the case. Alma, who lived before the coming of the Messiah, prophesies this. He, however, by divine appointment, abridged from those records, in his own style and language, a short account of the more important and prominent items, from the days of Lehi to his own time, after which he deposited, as he says, on the 529th page, all the records in this same hill, Cumorah and after gave his small record to his son Moroni, who, as appears from the same, finished, after witnessing the extinction of his people as a nation. …

This hill, by the Jaredites, was called Ramah: by it, or around it pitched the famous army of Coriantumr their tents. Coriantumr was the last king of the Jaredites The opposing army were to the west, and in this same vally, and near by, from day to day, did that mighty race spill their blood, in wrath, contending, as it were, brother against brother, and father, against son. In this same spot, in full view from the top of this same hill, one may gaze with astonishment upon the ground which was twice covered with the dead and dying of our fellow men. Here may be seen where once sunk to nought the pride and strength of two mighty nations; and here may be contemplated, in solitude, while nothing but the faithful record of Mormon and Moroni is now extant to inform us of the fact…

In this vale lie commingled, in one mass of ruin the ashes of thousands, and in this vale was destined to consume the fair forms and vigerous systems of tens of thousands of the human race—blood mixed with blood, flesh with flesh, bones with bones and dust with dust!


20 And again, what do we hear? Glad tidings from Cumorah! Moroni, an angel from heaven, declaring the fulfilment of the prophets—the book to be revealed. 

(Doctrine and Covenants 128:20)

For more references, see


The difference between the "Cumorah" taught by Book of Mormon Central and the real Cumorah taught by Joseph Smith, Oliver Cowdery, and their successors in Church leadership is evident from the map below, taken from the Spanish edition of Book of Mormon Central.

(click to enlarge)


* The M2C logo features a Mayan glyph to represent the Book of Mormon. This teaches everyone that Joseph and Oliver misled us by saying that the hill Cumorah of Mormon 6:6 was in New York. Instead, the brilliant scholars at Book of Mormon Central have decided that the "real Cumorah" is in southern Mexico, while the idea of Cumorah in New York was a false tradition that Joseph, Oliver and their successors in Church leadership ignorantly promoted for decades.

If Book of Mormon Central was an honest and accurate organization, their logo would represent the actual language of the Book of Mormon, which is English.

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